Charles Street on Digital Transformation, Adventure, and Empowering Communities

Let's talk about what you're working on Inkwasi adventures. OK. But before we get to that, the reason why I'm really interested in this Charles is because you're working full time. OK, you're working like nine to five and you're doing this in the evenings.

Charles (06:41)

Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (06:42)

And the bit that really kind of fascinates me and I refer to you as a changemaker on this podcast specifically is the people say, well, in my job, I can't really do anything. I can't really improve situations for people, but you're proven that that's not the case. You can actually do an awful lot of good for the world by taking on these projects. So before we get to that, I want to know a little bit more around what you do, because we have worked together, disclaimer folks, way back in.

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Charles (07:00)

Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (07:10)

I'm going to say 2014, I think it was around that time. Ten years ago in Australia, Charles was in charge of coffee and tea on the team. He used to go and get the coffee orders. He was not. You were were senior to me, think. But definitely we had a lot of fun working together. So maybe you will tell us how you describe what you do currently at the moment. What's your background as well, Charles?

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Charles (07:13)

Yeah.

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Make some last biscuits.

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Yeah, so yeah, I guess I've always been around transformation strategy, digital innovation. You know, we work together, CBA on a big digital transformation project. Yeah, think, yeah, I think the way I describe it is to kind of try and help lead organizations through big changes.

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Gerry Scullion (07:53)

this relation.

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Yeah.

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Charles (08:04)

But in particular, kind of, you know, strategic, unknown gray space, where, you know, it's a little bit of unknown, try and define it as you go. Lots of, uncomfortable for many in the organization. And you need this kind of handful of people, like when we were working together, of people who a little bit courageous, a little bit...

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Gerry Scullion (08:10)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Crazy.

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Charles (08:34)

optimistic of what's possible. And then you need that little bit of kind of belief that this can be done. So yeah, so at the moment I'll lead a very similar project at a bank in Australia or Bagwest. So we're transforming from a traditional bank into a digital only bank. It's part of CBA Group.

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Gerry Scullion (08:36)

Yeah.

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Okay.

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That's part of the Westpac group, isn't it? Part of the CBA group, okay.

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Charles (09:03)

Yeah, and it's a really interesting time because we're going from traditional regional bank into becoming a leading Australian digital bank. And yeah, so with that's a lot of internal change management, changing culture, mindset, ways of working, but also externally customers, the way they interact with the bank itself.

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Gerry Scullion (09:16)

Nice.

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here.

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Charles (09:32)

will change. But really interesting, it's all new technologies, new innovations. Yeah, so I enjoy that kind of space, bit of organized chaos, I think.

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Gerry Scullion (09:32)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I know for anyone listening, my people might say, that's a really unusual Australian accent that Charles has. And you're right. It is an unusual accent because it's not an Australian accent at all. Whereabouts in South Africa are you from originally?

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Charles (09:54)

Yeah.

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Yeah, so originally from Johannesburg, that's where I kind of grew up. And yeah, lived there probably half my life. But have been in Australia and back to Africa a few times, I guess I've always had this soft spot there. so did high school uni in Perth, Western Australia. Then I went back to the place where I did a bit of study.

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Gerry Scullion (10:03)

Okay.

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Yeah, we won't mention the rugby. I won't mention the rugby to you Charles. Yeah, yeah, like I'm looking out here at the Aviva Stadium in the distance. But for anyone who's not into rugby, Ireland and South Africa have a good rivalry over the last couple of years.

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Charles (10:27)

mean, why? They stay a bit longer. Yeah, yeah. We can talk a bit about that as well, if you like.

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And the RS have been generally involved, but you know.

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Gerry Scullion (10:49)

Yeah, I think we won the last test. So we'll just leave that here. The only reason I brought you on the podcast to get one up on you because for years you were always like, you're nothing, you're nothing. And I was like, yeah, we're going to be something. But I want to take you back to your time in South Africa. So you would have would you've been alive at the time of Mandela, you know, coming out of prison and, you know, the abolition of the apartheid.

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Charles (10:53)

Thank you.

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Thank

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Yeah, so we, yeah, I grew up doing that kind of apartheid time, but then when my parents moved to Australia, it was just before the shifting government over from, you know, when they're like coming out and change of government and stuff. And then when I went back to South Africa after uni, I left there about five, six years. So that was...

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Gerry Scullion (11:28)

coming in.

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Yeah.

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Charles (11:39)

Quite an interesting contrast to see kind of growing up there then being away and coming back and living there.

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Gerry Scullion (11:46)

What was it like, though, Charles? I know for many here we've read, you know, Mandela and we've a lot of us are aware what it was like. What was it like with that transformation? Obviously, it's an incredible story. But for you personally, what were the changes that you saw?

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Charles (12:03)

I think it was interesting because I think I was probably lucky in a way. think at the home I grew up with my parents stuff, I don't think there was ever any of that apartheid kind of thing. you know, I used to play with, you know, black friends and would be, and so I never really as a child got the whole thing about, you know, divide or things that they, you know, said.

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Gerry Scullion (12:17)

What's in there?

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Yeah, what was going on?

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Charles (12:32)

people can and can't do. I think what's really interesting, and this is probably, you know, relatable to any big organisation, if you think about a country going through a transformation, was this way in which, I guess, Mandela and everyone transitioned the country in a peaceful way, as much as possible, by, you know, just a massive amount of suddenly overnight

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Gerry Scullion (12:41)

Mm

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Yeah.

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Charles (13:01)

got this change in government change in way people have never had opportunities suddenly to have. But I think what it also showed was how it takes generations to kind of work it through because, know, and this is part of the inquiry kind of stuff is education is one of the biggest things, right? And so when people have been not had access to that, then

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Gerry Scullion (13:07)

Mm.

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Charles (13:28)

you know, it's put some way behind. And so, you know, it takes, takes a long time to, I think that's been one of the biggest transformation, I guess, is like access to education and stuff so that you can have this generation coming through. that's,

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Gerry Scullion (13:31)

Yeah.

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So we hear that time and time again, like education is one of the key things for to increase the success of any transformation. You've lived through the transformational time, either either being there within the society of South Africa or from Australia's perspective, looking onwards. And it's similar to me as well. Like I grew up in an era of violence and then we went through that transition and the Good Friday Agreement and we've, you

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Charles (14:06)

Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (14:11)

The guns are down and, you know, we're not living in total army. There's still still some subgroups there. For the most part, we're one. Talk to me about what the possibility of the possible, because when you're when you're working in South Africa and you're from South Africa, there's obviously a deep connection to you and the community that you're working with now at the moment in quasi.

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I want to talk to you about where it came from, because, you know, it's it's not something that you would take quite lightly in the same way. You know, I might start doing that. It's a lot of work and what you're trying to do at the moment. So talk to us about the inception of Inquasi.

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Charles (14:52)

Yeah, so Inception is really, yeah, that four or five years ago, you know, I guess, had this idea of how do you bring together the passion for, I guess, the country. mean, South Korea is one of the most beautiful countries in the world. It's got a unique wilderness of animals and wildlife.

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Well, know, wildlife and outdoors and stuff, that's very unique. The sense of outdoor adventure. So I think it's always, you know, life is an adventure, you know, going outside and outdoor adventures is a big passion. And then this whole thing about making a difference. it doesn't matter who you are, where you are in the world or how much money you have.

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Gerry Scullion (15:22)

Yep.

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Charles (15:45)

you can make a difference. so got together with two really good close friends of mine, Cornell and his wife Annika, pretty much grew up with Cornell as a brother. And we said, well, sorry. Yeah, the bride, watching playing rugby, cricket. Yeah, and basically it was this concept of how do you bring together this kind of

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Gerry Scullion (15:59)

at brigh.

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Charles (16:11)

making a difference through adventure, but taking people to this unique country and seeing stuff. And so we often talk about this concept of reset, reflect and reconnect. So the reset is almost, you know, and I think that the bend dropped when my kids were about three or four and we went to like in Sydney, Westfield and

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My daughter said to me as we walked in, are we going to get sushi and a baby tuna? And I was like, I didn't even know what sushi was until I was in uni. The world they're growing up is just so different. So it's almost like this concept of how can we take people out of this country where you've got everything going for you and have a of a reset moment, get out of your comfort zone.

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Gerry Scullion (16:49)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Charles (17:07)

create that space and time to be able to reflect on your life versus someone else. And then hopefully at the end of this adventure, when you come back home, you're reconnecting at this time with what's important in life. And so that difference between a person in Sydney can complain.

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Gerry Scullion (17:27)

Yeah, absolutely.

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Charles (17:33)

And the whole morning can be ruined because the train was five minutes late versus a kid in South Africa who needs to walk 10 kilometers to get to school. And they're the happiest, right? So you kind of just this perception of what's really important or how to be resourceful, make a plan, that kind of thing.

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Gerry Scullion (17:45)

or yeah.

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Yeah. So can I can ask you a bit more on the mechanics of Inquasi, OK, because I'm going through the process at the moment of trying to register something similar to this, but it's it's not in South Africa. It's more within Ireland going together with the two other people. You had to register this, correct? This is an entity that was registered. So as a registered as a.

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Charles (18:20)

Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (18:22)

Like a not for profit or as a charity like that whole status thing is something that we're facing at the moment. How did you get around that? What was your situation?

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Charles (18:30)

Yeah, at beginning, we spent quite a bit of time trying to wrestle with this to a registered as a charity or business. And we went with Australian registered business because I'm based in Australia. And the reason for that is because we want to take people on the tour on these adventures with us and they pay to come with us. And that's mostly cover.

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Gerry Scullion (18:44)

Yeah.

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Okay, nice.

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Charles (18:59)

the cost of the 10 day, it's about a 10 day all inclusive adventure. we go out, you pay one price, you get everything covered. One G ride in South Africa, we take care of everything. But the way in which to get around the charity bit was we partnered with the organization called Elephant Riders People, so ERP, and they're a registered charity, a non -profit.

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Gerry Scullion (19:05)

noise.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Charles (19:26)

And so all the money we fundraise for these bicycles that we purchase, 100 % of that money goes towards ERP and that's nonprofit side. you know, the way we set up the business is all the fundraising money goes into completely separate accounts. It's all 100 % goes towards bicycles. And it's only when the people come with us on the trip and pay for their trip.

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Gerry Scullion (19:34)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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It's a separate business. Yeah, absolutely. So talk to us because, you know, for anyone watching and listening, Charles messaged me on LinkedIn and we hadn't heard from each other in a few years ago. I've been messaging him throughout the years, but he just didn't respond. And only joking, of course. Charles said, I'm working on this great idea. And I had seen it. I think he'd mentioned it a few times on LinkedIn. I was like, fair play, Charles. I always knew you were a good guy. And I'm not just saying that on the podcast.

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Charles (19:54)

That's simple.

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Gerry Scullion (20:23)

And you're like, hey, look, would you be interested in sponsoring? I am going to sponsor. to do it after this year today. I'm going to buy a bike. And for anyone listening, I'll put a link into the show notes. If you want to purchase a bike and help the child get to school, which we're going to learn a bit more in the context of that, you can do so. We just click on the link below. So talk to us about the problem and how it was uncovered about getting people to school on time and the truancy rates and so forth.

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Charles (20:53)

Yeah, yeah, it's quite fascinating. in the really remote towns in South Africa, know, again, very different to here in Australia, I think people just assume kids go to the local schools around a corner. You either get dropped off with mom and dad or you get on a bus or, you know, ride your bike if you're close enough. But in these remote communities,

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Gerry Scullion (21:16)

Yeah.

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Charles (21:21)

some of these kids walk up to 20 kilometres a day just to get to school and back. And they, poor communities and quite remote. And so these kids often drop out of school because they get too exhausted. It's too hard to go for 12 years walking 20 kilometres a day. It's a long thing. that's during summer.

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Gerry Scullion (21:39)

Yeah.

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Charles (21:48)

winter rain, thunderstorms. And so when ERP started this bicycle, they call it BikeSport ERP. They saw a massive uplifting in academic rates. So basically one school, as an example, I think their matriculation rate was about 35%. So, you know, three, four kids out of 10 would finish school.

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Gerry Scullion (21:58)

Yeah.

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Charles (22:16)

As soon as they got bicycles, about nine out of 10 finished school. So massive uplift, right? And energizes the community. It gets, and the biggest impact is really these kids are now finishing school, they can go to university, they can get a proper job, and then they're empowered and set up for life, right? So it's this massive positive cycle into.

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Gerry Scullion (22:21)

Wow. Wow.

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Mm.

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Wow.

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Charles (22:44)

Yeah, so that's proven to really work. Some of these kids hand down their bicycles when they finish school to younger kids because they've seen the impact this has had on them. And again, you know, I contrast the experience in Australia, kids take it for granted. You get a bicycle when you're certain age, you get a new one. You look at the Virch collections and you see all these bicycles standing up there right. But

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For these kids, it's the first time they ever received a bicycle. And some of them only learned to ride on the day they get these new bicycles. And that's probably part of the best experience on the day when we hand out these bicycles is that you actually spend time helping these kids learn how to ride. And again, just looking at their determination, they don't complain or anything, they're not scared. For them, it's almost like if...

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Gerry Scullion (23:20)

And that's

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Yeah.

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Charles (23:39)

If I don't learn to ride this bicycle, I can't take it home, right? And so in a matter of an hour or two hours, they've learned how to ride a bicycle for first time. It's pretty amazing.

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Gerry Scullion (23:49)

Yeah, that's amazing. That's absolutely amazing. So the insight that came for, I guess, one part of Inquasi, was that something that you uncovered or was it through Annika? can't remember the name of other person that you mentioned.

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Charles (24:04)

Yeah, so when we started the question, said what something we can do or someone we can partner with who, and we want to make a real difference, not just a kind of handout of money or like a meal or something, want to make a real impact. The organization that Cornell and Anika works for, it's pretty amazing. ERP is part of that organization. So they've got a commercial side and then it's not

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Gerry Scullion (24:13)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Charles (24:34)

profit side. so they put it on to 1 % of their profits goes towards these charities. And so it's a really good organization the way they set up. And yeah, so through them, we got introduced to Nikolai who kind of started and founded this whole place with RP. And like you'll know as well, like in any partnership, you want to make sure there's mutual common vision and goals and stuff.

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Gerry Scullion (24:35)

Yeah.

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values.

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Charles (25:03)

Yeah, we just immediately knew like, you know, what they were doing and what they were looking for and what we were doing just kind of matched up really well.

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Gerry Scullion (25:13)

Yeah. So how do you handle it? So when people donate, which I'm going to be donating on behalf of the Human Centered Design Network, how do you close the cycle? Because people who donate say, I think it's 400 euros for one bike, isn't that correct? Or 400 dollars? That's about 50 Australian dollars to only joke and I'm making a joke at how weak the Australian dollar is at the moment.

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Charles (25:28)

It's about 400 Australian dollars. So what's that in euros?

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Yeah, yeah, that's right.

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Gerry Scullion (25:42)

And so whenever someone donates the four hundred Australian dollars, one of the pieces that when I've worked with not for profits before, it's closing that loop to make sure that the person who's donated feel that they've actually succeeded. And when he's gone to that place, is there any sort of stories or anecdotes that you can maybe share about closing that loop between the donator and.

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Charles (26:06)

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, so when people donate via our fundraising page, they become part of our Nkwazi community. And so part of that we share leading up to the what we call the bicycle drop, we share a couple of videos, insights as we prepare. You know, when the bicycles get bought, they deliver them boxes, we share some videos. And then the weekend that we do the drop, we do these kind of Facebook Live.

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Gerry Scullion (26:25)

Nice.

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email update.

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Charles (26:36)

posts and so people can follow and watch those along the way. And then after the bicycle drop, we usually do one of two things. So if you've donated like a whole bicycle, then you get your own personal photograph of the little boy or girl that got the bicycle. And so...

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Gerry Scullion (26:37)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I could get my photograph on a bike. that what you're telling me? you got a photograph of the person on the bike.

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Charles (27:04)

Well, you get a photograph of the little boy or girl that rides the bicycle. Yeah, which you know, it's a really nice thing to see the kind of smile on their faces when they receive their first bicycle. And then we usually make a bit of a video of the weekend, like a three to five minute video, which we share and people can actually see it all, you know, where their money is gone, which is really good. Yeah, and then obviously people come with us on the adventure.

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Gerry Scullion (27:15)

Yeah.

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Absolutely.

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Charles (27:33)

If they've also fundraised and donated money, then they will physically be part of handing out those bicycles, which is pretty cool.

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Gerry Scullion (27:38)

We can come.

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So on the website here, when I'm looking at it, saying our adventures, so people wanting to go to a humble, is that right? What's the the angle with that? Like if you're taking people from, say, Australia over to South Africa, what's the outcome that you're open to drive by bringing people from Australia over to South Africa, other than the fact that they're going to get more context and situational awareness of the problems? Is there anything other than that? Is there a business objective in terms of like

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Charles (27:48)

Yeah, but yeah.

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Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (28:09)

profit that can actually go back into the business to help more people get to school on time.

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Charles (28:16)

Yeah, so, yeah, we have people who've joined us from all over the world. This year, we've got someone coming to us from the UK as well, actually, which is... And, yeah, yeah, so basically that 10 -day adventure is really that kind of reset, reflect, reconnect kind of opportunity. But from a, I guess, a business point of view,

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Gerry Scullion (28:25)

Well, I'm an artist, so I'm not part of the UK, just to be very clear. This part of world.

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Yeah.

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Charles (28:45)

Like I mentioned at the start, this is a of a side passion that I'm working on. And so, yeah, we're not trying to make massive memory. We're just trying to make sure we can keep this up and running. Yeah, and hopefully, you know, get to a point where maybe we can do two ventures here and kind of build it from there. And yeah, maybe one day when I can...

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Gerry Scullion (28:49)

thing.

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the operation costs.

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Okay.

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Charles (29:14)

slow down in the corporate world, can maybe do this a bit more often. And as long as it's, what we really try and do is just make sure it's self -sustaining. And so,

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Gerry Scullion (29:19)

Absolutely.

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Yeah, absolutely. What does Nkwazi mean, just as a curiosity?

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Charles (29:30)

Yeah, so Ngozi is like a fish eagle in South Africa. And so that's the student name for it. yeah, again, eagle has been one of my favorite animals always. And so there's a bit of a play on that. But also, think, you know, being a strategist, I kind of like the concept of, you know, eagles fly really high, but they can pinpoint something down below and really go for that.

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Gerry Scullion (29:56)

Yeah.

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I get that I get that. So the goal at the moment, I think I saw earlier on says twenty four thousand Australian dollars is it you're trying to raise.

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Charles (30:06)

Yeah, that'll get us to 60 bicycles. And the reason for 60 is we've delivered about 143 bicycles to date over the last three to four years. And so that'll get us to the number 200 bicycle, which will be quite a nice story to tell here.

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Gerry Scullion (30:10)

Yeah.

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Yeah.

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It's amazing.

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Yeah, absolutely. In terms of like the the bit that comes after when you give them the bicycle, is there an educational piece there that how they can change their tires and how they maintain the bikes and so forth? Because I know from two young kids now when they got their bikes, they're like, Dad, tires flat. And I'm like, here you go. Here's another task. I'm trying to teach them like this is how you put the thing into the tire. You know, and you pump it. This is kind of getting it. And I'm sure it's not too dissimilar.

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Charles (30:50)

Yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (30:58)

out in South Africa when their bike tire is flat as a puncture. What's the system around that, the maintenance piece around that? Is there anything else we do around that?

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Charles (31:07)

Yeah, it's a really good question. as part of the charity, the bikes for the RP, part of the money goes towards employing a local mechanic in the community. And so he or she is provided with all the tools and the things and they get trained up on how to maintain and fix these bicycles. And so the kids can go to that person anytime, doesn't cost them any money.

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Gerry Scullion (31:19)

very good.

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Yeah, break.

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Charles (31:37)

The main thing is to make sure the bicycles stay up. The children also obviously learn some basic maintenance because when they're riding quite far distances, so they get a small toolkit that they can use themselves. And then we usually fit the wheels with what they call permatubes, which I discovered you can't find in Australia anyway. I'm struggling to find them for my own kids because

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Gerry Scullion (31:47)

Yeah.

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Charles (32:05)

I'm getting tired of fixing punctures. But these are solid fill tubes that you put inside the tires. So they can pretty much ride over anything and they won't get a puncture or flat tire.

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Gerry Scullion (32:10)

you

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Yeah.

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You get on some road in some cars as well. They've got the technology that means it doesn't go flat flat

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Charles (32:31)

Yeah, so that definitely makes a big difference. Makes the bikes a little bit heavier, that definitely helps.

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Gerry Scullion (32:38)

more robust. Yeah, absolutely. It's a great example, Charles, of, for people that they're who are listening, who they might be in an opportunity or in a role, should I say, where there's very little opportunity to apply some of their human centeredness to to the world. And you're a great example of doing these things. And I vaguely remember you talking about something similar to this one day over coffee 10 years ago. So

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I'll put a link to the donate so people can donate in quasi, but also if they want to buy a bike or maybe there's a group of you that want to club together and buy a bike and follow along on the journey. It's a fantastic one. I'm going to see how I can actually collaborate with you a little bit more and trying to push this because I think 60 bikes is totally doable. especially if there's anyone here from a corporate who's listening to the podcast and wants to reach out, reach out to Charles directly. I'll put a link to Charles email in there as well, because

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And it would be really nice thing for brands to to get to get involved with this, especially I think you mentioned that they can actually put a little bit of a logo on the bike as well. Is that right?

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Charles (33:42)

Mm.

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Yeah, we definitely we do lots of exciting things. So we've had a couple of businesses and a couple of schools also who get involved who'd love to use that opportunity to tell their kids about differences in schools and stuff. And so we usually get the logos from these organizations. And then when we build the bicycles and set them all up, we put the little stickers on the bicycles. And so it's almost like the

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Gerry Scullion (34:05)

Yeah.

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Charles (34:18)

the Formula One concept, right? So this bike has been sponsored by all these schools or businesses. And yeah, it's just a nice way for the kids also who get the bicycle to understand that, you know, these organizations and schools and people have all done to give them a bicycle. It's not just a handout, right? It's a yeah.

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Gerry Scullion (34:22)

you

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, absolutely. That's great for them to feel connected as well. Say, well, like all of these people are actually here. They're on our side and they want us to succeed as opposed to that whole kind of singular perspective of like it's us and them against the world. The people here, especially people listening to this podcast in particular, really want to get the best possible outcomes for to try and help more of an equitable world. This is a really fantastic one. And I totally if I had a hat on me here, I'd tip my hat to you.

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Charles (34:47)

Yes.

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Gerry Scullion (35:09)

on that Charles, I'd love to hear you get out. When are you going to be aiming to deliver these bikes?

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Charles (35:14)

Yeah, so we're going in October. yeah, we're living in about five, six weeks. Yeah, so I'll definitely be in Tarso and I'll let you know how it goes. I'll be sharing some photos and videos. Yeah, and you know, because after the bicycles, we go off in the bush for about five days and do your whole hiking safari. And so it's actually about two weeks before we come back.

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Gerry Scullion (35:19)

too far away.

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Okay.

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Yeah, for sure.

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And it's. Living the dream. Look, Charles, great to catch up with you and I'll update everyone when we hear more about it, but I'm going to be sponsoring for at least one of those bikes anyway. So you've got 59 to him for now.

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Charles (35:52)

Yeah, no, excellent. Thanks, Jaren. It's always really great to catch up and I've been following your podcast. So seems like you're doing some good work for change.

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Gerry Scullion (36:03)

Ha ha ha. Good man, Charles. I'll talk to you soon. Cheers,

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Charles (36:06)

Thank you.

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